Sportsmanship

[Salinga]

2) Talking down to other players for any reason

That's why I mostly play in fullscreen with the chat window off.

[Big Head Zach]

maybe if we would count the overall score of the colony + weigh in the place of each player it would help make it easier being second or third (or even fourth, if a high colony score)?

Maybe the "first place or no points" approach of the ranking system does make people regard the outcome so extreme?

Example: Award points = Colony category (0-7) * (5 - Rank)

Changing to a more complex system is currently out of scope timewise, but anyone having a similar simple idea to take into account the rank + score of a game, please explain here :-)

Already did. The system I proposed not only rewarded players more for being 2nd/3rd in a high-colony-score game, it also allowed new players to rank up quicker if they beat opponents who are consistently good players.

[maskdbandt]

rommager, you need not hide my name from your thread.... i play to try to win the game... that's how i feel most people do it... if i'm losing, i don't try to throw the game by helping someone else relative "out of spite"... unfortunately some people do but i won't name names to be courteous to people that were not respectful of the game... if people are trying to just go for a good colony score and affect the winner of the game, they should let it be known at first... it's ashame that people cannot have equal chance of winning... i understand you selling the energy was not exactly affecting the game but it was the principle of the selling... had you been in 2nd by only a little bit, you would not have sold the energy at any price and hoped for a good production relative to the person currently in first place...  please remember that if you broadcast publically, everyone sees it... you may not want others to see that you throw the game if you see you have no chance of winning... cheers and good luck with all your future games... even if i am losing, i don't try to throw the game to who i want to win just for spite... interestingly enough your argument only proves my point

[piete]

On our C64 tournaments it was common that if my worst rival (=one of the best friends) realised he could not win he would do anything to stop me from winning. I didn't care, if I won in the end the victory was even sweeter...

Said it once, say it again: This is just a game!

[maskdbandt]

good point piete.... i have to admit perhaps i exaggerated what happened... for that i apologize globally toward rommager... perhaps i would've done the same thing in rommager's shoes... who knows... but yes, all factors should be assumed in the game and one should expect anything to happen, even people selling in round #12 for absurd prices to pick who they want to win... that's one reason i always am on the sell line instead of buy during round 12 just in case something like that happens... it at least might prevent that... i would hope no one would do that but then again, it easily could

cheers!  mule is awesome!

[rommager]

No worries maskdbandt - I do play to help overall colony score, and mostly for the fun of it.  Lets face it though: it really wouldn't be M.U.L.E. if there wasn't a certain amount of backstabbing and spite.  Still, it's all in good fun.  I just took it more personal because I was criticized for simply playing a game for the sake of fun, and not so much for competitiveness.  I didn't do anything overly annoying - not much dancing around or degrading talk.  I was getting third place whether I sold energy or not.

Yea, I took some offense when you basically said "No offense, but I'm not playing with you anymore because you're an idiot player" (That is paraphrased - you only implied my idiocy).  I guess one of my things is that we have to wait forever for four human players, so I would rather have a crappy human player, who knows the game well, over an AI player or someone who is playing for the very first time.  This thread on sportsmanship only gave me opportunity to vent.   

It was a very fun game, and I would gladly play with you again.  A little smack talk rivalry is never a bad thing, so long as it doesn't get personal.   

[Intergalactic Mole]

My solution: High scores are on each players local machine, where only they can see it.  Just like any other arcade game.  Do I really care if anyone besides me is rank #1?  No!   End of story!!

[Tei]

Part of the fun of playing MULE is meeting different people with different game style and target. YES, there are more than TWO target (colony win, personal win). I also have meet the "rude ultra-competitive" player that dont understand cooperation....  on Mule, of all games... Is somewhat disgusting. But is part of the beaty of it, to meet people that way. You takes notes of the names of these players, and avoid playing with then.  On all my games (about 40 maybe) I only have meet people that style once, so it seems is a minority of players.

I also play L4D, and I have meet horrible people there, but also nice people. Even on a game like L4D designed to make you angry, you can build a list of "friends", people that is nice and you have fun playing with, I guest the same thing works for MULE, built a list of cool people to play with, avoid the "rooting apples"

[C64 nostalgia]

I think MULE is game. Some people place nicely, and some do not. But, I don't hold the players who are ultracompetitive against them, because MULE is a game. As long as there are no personal attacks (exceptions among friends) outside of the boundaries of the game, I see no problem with taunting and the like. I know other people desire or tolerate different things...

I think a simple solution would be some sort of reputation metric; a self-designation of personal level of competitiveness; and/or a self-designation of tolerance for the highly competitive, cursing, and what not. Or even more simply, though far less informative, a friend/avoid marker. In this way, players know what kind of opponents they will be playing. If a player is uncomfortable, they can choose not to play in a game based on the above information. Also, a player could change the way they play based on overall player preferences for a particular game.

I find myself playing at different levels of competitiveness. I try to be very helpful to new players who want to learn and know the basics. Conversely, when I play good players, I find myself much more competitive. And with people I know well, I can play ultracompetitively, but I also know they are okay with it.

People want different things... Our community should help foster satisfaction, not remove gamesmanship.

[egrutt]

Hey!  I dance all the time (But it is disco dancing with my MULE, not in auctions).  I've been accused by 2 opponents (in same game) of being a poor sport.  It was because i starved them out since they hogged up all the good ore plots.  I've played many people here and in other games and never been accused and cried too like that.  So after many rounds of complaining and boo hoos I gave in and feed em all to shut em up.

    My question is:  Do you consider that bad sportsmanship or a plan to win?  Denying people food and or energy when u have it (BTW after turn 2 of them all building ore they had no food or energy for next 6 turns).

     Oh and then they have the nerve to laugh when they end up winning cause I caved in and let them off the hook.

[Intergalactic Mole]

IMO the only poor sportsmen in MULE are people who are sore losers and accuse others of cheating just because they do something to spite you in the game.  Name calling isn't nice either.

[Bertoid]

You mean like a host quitting the game when he's losing?  You know who you are. 

[Comrade Kangaroo]

The issue of sportsmanship is very subjective as everyone has different ideas of what it means to be a good sport. Deep down inside we all know if we've played fair or not. You can make all the excuses and lies you want to over the internet, but you can't fool yourself.

Players who don't sell food or energy aren't poor sports. They're just players who missed out on ore or crystite or good plots or MULEs, etc. They want to win just like all the rest of us. If you talk smack to players during a game, then you're just fueling the stereotype of an internet jerk (someone who forgets that that person on the other end is human no matter how many miles may separate them). Grow up I say to all you internet jerks. It's hard enough to get a game most times of the day. Internet jerks make it even harder by driving players away. We should be encouraging people to play, not making them feel bad for not knowing the rules of the game as well as you do. Play fair, help new players out, and have fun. It's that simple. MULE is boring as hell without actual humans to play with.

[Mega Byte]

Dave,
   I have to agree with you.  There is one exception to your list in #4, where I did abort a game because one of the players was being abusive to the other players in what they were saying.  I just told everyone, "look, I'm not putting up with this, and I am closing this game", and did so...
   I am not a "cut-throat" MULE player, and I have NO problem losing to someone who has just outplayed me.  But the taunting, and juvenile stuff is annoying.
   I do think the heavy weight of only a 1st place win impacting overall "standing" is too lopsided.  I'd like to see anything that would add more balance to that system.
   -S

[Mega Byte]

I had someone accuse me of cheating in the game... I have to say, that has to be the most infantile thing a person can do... how can you possibly CHEAT in MULE??? There are no "glitches" to exploit (or at least not that everyone has equal access to).  The only way possible to "Cheat" would be if you were a developer and somehow had access to the client and/or server code, and could exploit it that way.  So silly to claim a "Cheat" in an on-line video game.
That's just silly.
-S