Mule 2 Suggestions

[Rhodan]

Mule 2 as it stands now may never capture my interest but I would like to subjectively offer some suggestions for Mule 2 that would help it to capture mine and others interest over Mule one.

In mule one and in mule 2(if you don't nerf it) the art, skill and strategy of being last carries a huge strategic value if you can do so without falling to far behind. It lets you develop commodities others may not have. It gives you first choice to buy and sell at auction (corner the market by buying all of a commodity). Higher chance of good events and no bad events, Releasing of mules so other players will have none, Watching assays to learn where the cyrstite is, etc., etc..

Are you absolutely committed and stuck to having 2 concurrent development waves?

            Did you choose this method strictly to save total game play time because of a fifth player?
            Do you think it is more fun to have added  a arcade element to a pure strategy game?

Regardless of the reason this change takes away a good bit of the above strategic elements of mule.

If you had 6 players I would suggest 3 waves of concurrent development two at a time to make it balanced

But with five players and two waves we loose to much of the above mention strategic elements in not developing sequentially.

Should we increase it to 3 or 4 waves?  

There will always be a odd man out and lost of the above strategic elements with a odd number of players.

I suggest one wave everyone develops at the same time. Possibly make the development time longer giving players time to swap out a mule or two after seeing what there competition has put out before the timer ends.
Each player should be able to catch the wampus once per development if he chooses to commit his time to that activity.

The best solution is make it a game option so we can choose either type: Sequential or Concurrent (with one development phase not two or more) before the game starts.

This will appeal to the strategic players who don't mine a longer game but want a experience that is truer to mule one but with FIVE PLAYERS!

The concurrent option will appeal to those arcade types and new players  looking for a shorter game that is different but similar.

While HD graphics in 3D is pretty it hurts mule 2 more then it helps. Keep the HD but stick to 2D! especially in the auction phases. Put the numerical bid back on a players auction line. Part of the fun of the auction phase is the feeling you are racing your opponents up and down to sell and buy. 3D doesn't portray this well and each players inventory surplus, shortage, sell and buy price needs to be easily seen in one location on his avatar and bid line  so your eyes are not moving up and down from the bottom of the screen to the bid lines.
Remember one of Mule's major strategic elements is time management. Making the correct choices under the gun so to speak while the timer is ticking.
Hence why it is so much fun having sequential turns in development and watching your opponents screw up by accidentally releasing mules, making poor development choices, etc. and sending some encouraging comments in chat while he plays his turn.

While we are on the topic of time management and choices the new  store lay out removes some of those time management choices that  mule one has by choosing which side to enter the store on to develop.
Instead of the traditional mining on one side and food/nrg n the other. Maybe splitting it up with smithore and food on one side and crystite and energy on the other side will offer a needed change.

More to come after a few more mule 2 games.  

Rhodan

[john256]

Speaking as a PLAYER, it sounds like a few people are basically saying they'd like PM2 if it was exactly the same as PM1. Clearly, that isn't going to happen - PM2 is deliberately a re-imagining of MULE rather than an attempt to totally remake the original - that's what PM1 does. In PM1 you get players complaining the algorithm used for MULE prices is not absolutely the same as on Atari for instance.

It seems to me that old-school MULE players really just want to play old-school MULE, for them graphics are really not important and ANY change to the game is close to heresy!

Whereas PM2 is more geared to players who are not necessarily MULE nuts, but simply people who want to play a turn based strategy game.

 --Puts admin hat back on--

[data2008]

I agree with both Rhodan and John:

People who try Mule2 expect it to behave quite the same as M1 but with bigger map and fifth player... but that is not going to fly well due to several reasons and there wouldnt even be a purpose for doing it the same way as PM1.
It's of course very much a psychological effect because people are acustomed to things over a long time:

http://wiki.classictw.com/images/8/82/PCW_5.jpg

If you look at the original Mule, you didnt even have HUDS in auctions that displayed the other amount of goods a player had, also there was no number above the players sprite so you had to look down... just saying that people who play PM1 on one side always critized how PM1 was NOT 100% like the original, but that WAS part of the original strategy that you had to remember how many goods you had during auctions, that you had to look down to see the price you were bidding in the auction, etc.

The point I agree with Rohan is that the 3D auction does not feel well enough and we could switch that to a 2D view. Also thinking about 3 waves of development to be again shorter than PM1 even though of a 5th player is worth thinking about, so 2 leading, 2 middle and the trailing player get their dev round, so trailing player should be the most informed one and can catch wampus independetly.

Otherwise I guess people need to give PM2 a chance free of prejudeces that easily build up fast from comparing PM1. Just play it for a few times to wrap around the new ways of playing this game, while PM1 still is what it is and is always there to be played regardless of how PM2 develops.

Thanks for all giving the game a chance and testing it and providing feedback, this is probably how the oroiginal Mule team did it too in that phase and tweaked and developed the game into what Mule 1 became then.

[Rhodan]

I agree with both Rhodan and John:

People who try Mule2 expect it to behave quite the same as M1 but with bigger map and fifth player... but that is not going to fly well due to several reasons and there wouldnt even be a purpose for doing it the same way as PM1.
It's of course very much a psychological effect because people are acustomed to things over a long time:

http://wiki.classictw.com/images/8/82/PCW_5.jpg

If you look at the original Mule, you didnt even have HUDS in auctions that displayed the other amount of goods a player had, also there was no number above the players sprite so you had to look down... just saying that people who play PM1 on one side always critized how PM1 was NOT 100% like the original, but that WAS part of the original strategy that you had to remember how many goods you had during auctions, that you had to look down to see the price you were bidding in the auction, etc.

I think you have the wrong idea of what we diehard original mule fans want.

Change is good. Options to choose the degree of change is even better.

The original atari mule had flaws. There was a lot room for improvement. What it did have was near perfect strategic game play that forced you to interact and react to your competitors actions..

PlanetMule One improved upon this. It is now a better game then the original. I think Mule 2 can improve upon it even more.

In PlanetMule Two you are changing those game play basics mainly with the concurrent development.
I don't know what I can say to impress upon you how concurrent development removes a huge amount of game play and strategic action. The only thing it adds is a SHORTER GAME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

My opinion is if you keep concurrent development  and don't add sequential then you need to have just one longer development round. Anything more is just lengthening the game and adding no play value.

Hell just give us guns and hand grenades and will shoot and blow up each others plots during development!!!
Imagine trying to get a mule out of the store and on your plot  with 4 players trying to shoot and kill you!!
Now that might be a game I would play.

Mule is unique, original. There is no other game out there like it or that even comes close..
Planet II Mule can be that and more  Bigger and better with options and game play that will appeal to the greater audience.
 
I know it will take a lot of programming and hard work to add those options but if you plan to market mule 2 and not offer it free like mule 1. I think that work will return your investment 10 fold.

I cant speak for the rest but I for one would like to have a Mule 2 with new game play features and options to choose. If I had that it would replace mule one and give me one place to go, one community to play mule!

Rhodan




 

[sjleader]

I would 100% make a $10-$20 donation to support building of an awesome game and community.

[john256]

As a player, I personally would prefer MORE real-time aspects to Mule2! I definitely don't think a game which makes you spend 80% of the time doing nothing is going to attract many totally new players, compared to one which takes the principles of Mule into a more modern type of game.

Probably most MULE fans would disagree with me, but MULE fans are a tiny minority of online gaming fans. So it's all very subjective is my point...you can't possibly make a statement what will attract more players any more than I can, only voice personal opinions and preferences. Since PM2 is currently only being played my MULE players, obviously opinions are likely to be biased. If we did a beta and advertised it on gaming sites to players who had never played MULE, probably the bias would be the opposite and they might all say "it's too slow, nothing happens".

Again, that is my personal opinion as a player. I don't speak for the designers (I just make it do what they ask )

[sjleader]

SUGGESTION:
No events on round one. Not fair for someone to have radiation or pests the first round.