Land Grant alternative proposal

[GabrielPope]

Well in the current system, you really don't have any ability to judge other players priorities so the "Blind Grant" that I proposed is exactly the same.   The only thing in the current system is that you know is what others have picked then you know you're safe to pick something in the lower right.

It's an interesting idea you have to have it auto pick to the right in case of a failure. Doing so would be faster than having players re-pick new plots.  But you then bring up the question of what happens if you pick the bottom right most plot and fail?  I guess you could keep the current theme of "you don't get a plot" but personally I hate that aspect of the current land grant system and is something I'd want to change if I were going to redo the current system.

I think there has been a miscommunication here. I wasn't talking about automatically assigning the next plot over; I just meant restricting players' re-picks to lots that were further along in the current selection order. Basically the same system as presently exists,

Knowing when and where other players have used their picks is exactly the feature I was talking about. Early on when there are many potentially desirable plots I find it very useful to wait a bit and see if anyone else bites on any of the early plots, which lets me judge how long I can wait before I need to start trying to pick. Watching the land other players go for also gives me an idea of what I should be going for; if the first two river tiles go, then I'm going to look for a mountain, whereas if everyone else is going for mountains I'm going to go for a river.

(After the first few turns all the high-value plots are usually staked out and picks mostly become a matter of trying to link together plots for EOS bonuses.)

[vaylen]

1) Where do players start?  Do they start on each of the 4 sides of the store?  

If they do, that means the two start in the river spaces would be slower or put a player at a disadvantage. So maybe North/South starting positions are reserved for 1st and 2nd place?  While East/West would be for 3rd and 4th?

They all start in the center of the base with the screen zoomed out into full colony view.  A timer could count down from 5 before it would start, then everyone could run any direction they wanted.

1a) What do you do for the first land grand where no one is really ranked?  

Just randomly select who gets screwed?  I suppose you could also start players in random plot that contains no geographical feature or alternatively in the 4 corners (super spread out).

In the first land grant everyone runs the same speed so nobody has an advantage.  The speed difference used after the first round could be very tiny or it could be based on the size of that player's lead.

2) How much time do players have to get a plot?

Unlimited might sound nice, but waiting for someone to make up there mind could really slow the game down.  I'd be inclined to say there is a set time frame and then the land grant phase would end.  

I think the time bar used for this phase should be the amount of time it takes to run from the base to the top left of the colony then to the bottom right of the colony assuming no mountains are run through and the riverbed is run through once.  The base speed of the players should be akin to how fast they move when dragging a MULE out across the colony during their turn.

3) What happens when time runs out and players have not pushed a button?

Do they just not get a land?  That would keep in theme of the current version, but again I'd like to add a safety net.  Could give them what ever location they are over, assuming it's  not owned -- but that brings up the question of what happens if it is owned?  I think the fall back solution would be to randomly give them an unowned plot if the time ends and they have not pushed a button to claim a plot.

If they never claim a land, I would punish them by not giving them a land so they will learn to choose a land during this phase, but I would also GREATLY increase the chances that they will get a free plot during the random event phase (for the first time this happens to them in the game only)

4) How much time should players have?  Should this time limit be based on something?  

In the current game when ever you have a time bar, it is based on your food.  Would it be better to have 4 timers and have the Land Grant time be limited also based on food on hand?  This could add more value to food...   But if you're behind it could mean you'll just get further behind as you fail to pick up a plot of land.  Yes, overall having the timer based on food is most likely a horrible idea.  

Food should not be a factor here because everyone gets to go at the same time.  Food is used for "your" time where everyone else has to wait on you (ie your turn).  There is no need to make food more valuable than it already is.

[bobc455]

I gotta chime in and vote for the status quo. It's part of the feel of the game that makes it fun.

I love the feel of a retro-game, let's not change it into another game.

Sorry if you think I'm a crotchety old fuddy duddy...

-BC

[vaylen]

I gotta chime in and vote for the status quo. It's part of the feel of the game that makes it fun.

I love the feel of a retro-game, let's not change it into another game.

Sorry if you think I'm a crotchety old fuddy duddy...

-BC

The topic of this thread is Gameplay Ideas.  By its very nature it is asking what could be added to a "MULE 2" as it were.  There is no need to call for status quo in such a thread.  Doing so might even classify someone a troll.

[GabrielPope]

The topic of this thread is Gameplay Ideas.  By its very nature it is asking what could be added to a "MULE 2" as it were.  There is no need to call for status quo in such a thread.  Doing so might even classify someone a troll.

I guess you can call me a troll, then, because I must reiterate that I find this proposal unappealing compared to the status quo. Even a modestly laggy 200ms ping plays havoc with the game's netcode in auctions and I'd really rather not play a game where such a fundamental feature as the land grant is based on an even more action-heavy sequence.

[data2008]

Of course a discussion of any new proposal includes people expressing whatever thoughts they have, so let's not call someone a troll, if he/she likes to see an updated version still with an original gameplay feature left intact.

[vaylen]

I wasn't calling someone a troll. I was saying that when discussing in a thread which by its very nature is about what IDEAS people have to change the game, to come in and try to say no changes should be made MIGHT be construed as being a troll.

Of course a discussion of any new proposal includes people expressing whatever thoughts they have, so let's not call someone a troll, if he/she likes to see an updated version still with an original gameplay feature left intact.

[rommager]

All trolling aside, my vote is that we can change the land grant phase.  It's not really adding any odd elements that will change the base game, and so long as it's put in a "Deluxe" version.

Still, I think keeping a "Classic" version that is as close to the original game play is a good idea.

[Jaradakar]

For a moment, lets assume in MULE 2.0 we wanted to expand the number of players to 5.

Lets also assume that we'd want to expand the map to be bigger and have more grid spaces, enough for every player to gain the same number of plots of land the current MULE allows.

Problem #1
Current Land Grant Phase would take longer.

Solutions

What are peoples ideas? 

[Jaradakar]

For a moment, lets assume in MULE 2.0 we wanted to expand the number of players to 5.

Lets also assume that we'd want to expand the map to be bigger and have more grid spaces, enough for every player to gain the same number of plots of land the current MULE allows.

Problem #1
Current Land Grant Phase would take longer.

Solutions

What are peoples ideas?  

1) The Land Grant Cursor could move x2 as fast.  Of course this could make it so it's harder for people to get the exact land they want.

2) Multiple Cursors exist (Top & Bottom -- One travels clockwise, the other counter clockwise) and you'd have to move your joystick up/down/left/right to select which one you want to be active.  When you hit your button to gain a plot you would select the plot under the active cursor only.

[poobslag]

2) Multiple Cursors exist (Top & Bottom -- One travels clockwise, the other counter clockwise) and you'd have to move your joystick up/down/left/right to select which one you want to be active.  When you hit your button to gain a plot you would select the plot under the active cursor only.

or a variation on that idea - the cursor moves by 3x3 blocks (it's a GIANT cursor) and, you press your button plus one of the nine directions on your joystick, to pick one of those nine plots. so if you want the upper-leftmost plot, you'd wait until the cursor appeared, and then press up + left + your button

logically, this would mean the board would logically grow to a 9x6 board, since that's a nice multiple of 3x3.

[gdgdgdgd]

Thats not fair!!!!!
I had already said that in 9x9 board, and in Cool Alternatives!!!!!!!!!!!!!
They copied me!!!!!

Well, it doesnt matter......

[zaphod77]

i think i've got a good system.

use clicks.

phase 1. all 4 players click.
land grant cursor sweeps, stops at first one selected.
ties get broken, one player gets plot
phase 2.  remaining 3 click on an unpassed plot.
land grant cursor sweeps, stops at first one selected.
ties get broken, one player gets plot

you get the idea.

this way you can change your mind after a plot is gotten by another player even if it's not the one you tried for.

keeps all the strategy of the original, but removes reflexes as a factor.

[data2008]

Great idea! The only thing is that it _requires_ mouse for not being to cumbersome?

[zaphod77]

Well you could move selection boxes with keyboard/stick instead.

Also we can say give a 10 second time limit for each phase, and if no one selects one in any of the 4 phases, the grant ends instantly, and if someone misses a chance, they can still try next phase.

The important concept is that all players chose the square they want to "hit the button" on, and then it advances till someone gets one, and then the remaining players get to change their mind after someone gets a plot, but they can't pick a passed property.