game evolution (poll)

[arghman]

OK, we've had a bunch of posts that get into arguments like "make the pirates stop stealing smithore!" "no, keep it the way it is!" "but in the original game they didn't steal smithore...." "those days are over, move on...."

I'd be willing to bet that most people here are either purists (keep the game as close as possible to the original) or like the game more or less as it is, with a few tweaks if necessary, and that there aren't many people who are purists about some game features but like the new game for other features.

Could we have a discussion about overall game design philosophy? How would you like to see M.U.L.E. evolve?

[Big Head Zach]

Other:

I would like to see the option for having both the original gameplay, plus customizable features. I believe there's room for both. I may be overgeneralizing things, but there's a number of common games out there that originally were taught as instructed out of the box, but now are played with optional extras to 1) suit players' personal tastes, and 2) keep the game fresh.

If I didn't know how to play Poker, I would want to have the ability to play the easiest version first (5-card draw) to figure out how things work, and then later on, be able to try out variants that I like.

That's why I feel the developers' priority is to first achieve the exact gameplay of the original (or close to it as possible, short of UI tweaks and improvements - things that benefit from modern computing technology), and then put the feelers out for what the fans would like to see.

That way, people from both camps can play the games they want, and no one complains. Yay! 

[Jaradakar]

I believe some of this is a mute point.

Seeing how the developers are having to reconstruct the original, it's in there best interest to hit that mark.  

Personally I'm fine with minor improvements (like north/south store exits, improved graphics, internet play, etc) but I think improvements should be very minimalistic.

I think the argument of "no keep it the way it is" is invalid for two main reasons:

1) People generally dislike change -- so they're going to want to keep things how they are (despite the smithore imbalance -- which imo is not fixed by pirates taking it).

2) The truth of the matter is, most people don't know what they want.  Often times they're bias towards their latest experience with the game (good or bad).  Or they're wanting something to change based of a very very small sample size (1-2 games) instead of scientific gathering of data over a large sampling of games.

2a) Yes, some users are very sharp and truly have a great understanding of the under-workings of all the systems and so in that sense some user feedback is very welcome.  Also typically developers are short on time, while players/users often have vast amounts of free time. So developers need to capitalize on that main difference and one of the ways is sift through posts for user feedback that are valid (but not every post is).

So I guess my overall point, just because some people say "No leave it the way it is!" That is not always the correct avenue.

-Jara

PS: That's not to say I don't want a new versions of MULE, I really do!  Some of Big Head Zach points on "customizable features" I think are good ideas, I just think they should be saved for MULE 2!

That way people who want the original experience will play MULE 1 and those who want to play the new improved version will play MULE 2.  

PPS: But overall It'll be easier to improve upon MULE if they can recreate the original experience first, then push into all new territory with a true sequel.

[Pod]

Fudge the original.

[machinus]

minimal changes to attract a wide audience. if successful you can always have two versions!

[cecil]

Frack the original.

The Truth About Forums


At any rate, I feel like the kind of features and updates that should be implemented to attract a larger audience are mostly visual.  M.U.L.E. is not the kind of game I would necessarily want open to anyone and all, but I think that the kind of players who would be attracted to the game would are the kind of players who play 4X games.  So having a wider ranger of planets to choose from, and maybe implementing the racial differences in the game would open that up.  The kinds of changes M.U.L.E. could use are more creative than algorithmic, in my opinion.

I would like to see the player count sky rocket because I would like to see advertisements in the lobby of the game.  It feels like the developers have brought us this amazing game and we aren't paying for it, and they also have a strong sense of giving to the community what we ask.  The least we could do is deal with advertising so they could generate revenue to support the game.

[Big Head Zach]

2012 the original.

The Truth About Forums

Sad, but effing true.

I would like to see the player count sky rocket because I would like to see advertisements in the lobby of the game.  It feels like the developers have brought us this amazing game and we aren't paying for it, and they also have a strong sense of giving to the community what we ask.  The least we could do is deal with advertising so they could generate revenue to support the game.

If done the right way, I think people wouldn't mind it a bit - in fact, it might be downright funny - perhaps seeing a few billboards in "town" might liven the place up a bit!

[n3cr0m33p5]

Voted : Other

Loved the original and that should be the main focus initially, get as close to the original as possible then do the add-ons / options as others have suggested.

[amz181]

I want something more. The game in its current state is not versatile enough to keep interest peeked, meaning that it will get boring pretty easily, the game just isnt complex enough to offer a large playtime.

More players i think wouldnt work for the simple reason that it would take ages to go through turns.

What i want is a few more resources, and more events, and just generally more depth. That would elongate the playtime sevenfold, instead of the game in its current state which will certainly get boring relatively quickly.

[Soldier Ant]

Loved the original and that should be the main focus initially, get as close to the original as possible then do the add-ons / options as others have suggested.

I agree. I voted "something different", but i think the original was very balanced and "complete", and the possible loss of interest mentioned by amz181 would not be a problem with hotseat play, where players can interact much easier with another: you can talk while you play, but you can't type in the chat window while you play.
And I think player interaction is a very important factor of the game.

[Prez]

The vote is incomplete. The Original was a fully balanced game, I never tired to play this version and I still own the C64 only to play the old Mule, unfortunately we must be in the same room, sometimes I'd like to play from my house having just an hour to play it via internet, so the new version allowes the play on line.
Sometimes  I'd like to play a game more fresh, or with new features (any kind), so the right word is "CUSTOM IT!!"
We need some options to play the game as we like at the moment of play.
Old\new style
kind of music
Gollumer or Bonzoid
4\8\12\2056 turns?
faster\slower
CUSTOM, CUSTOM, CUSTOM, people is different and so also the game.
Sure we need the modern features such play on line, statistics, Hi-scores and so on!!!
Wath about the old style gifs of the plot? I like it a lot !!!
Prez (Fabio)

[BubbaBrown]

I say just make the game very configurable and modular.  This way everyone can win.  How?  When you create a game, you choose the module or "rule set" to use.  This way everyone can choose the game they want.  Some XML configuration files here, a few image PNG's there, and a standardized API for the really insane modder, all packaged up in a zip file ready to be download and loaded by the MULE client.

The general game format wouldn't change much, but this way people can fill in the details themselves.

[arghman]

custom game rules are fine by me (would be helpful to test playability), but

(a) you'd have to get all the human players to agree on them
(b) scores shouldn't count towards the high scores on this website, since there's no way to compare high scores in a custom game to high scores in any other game except the variety played.

[slube]

I agree with most of the suggestions here - it should have a few modes:

1. Classic - as close as possible to the original, "mistakes" and all (though original graphics and sound are optional - for those purists, the emulator is always available).

2. Classic with tweaks - using that as a template, a whole mess of optional variations - cost and volatility of resources, frequency of events, intelligence of A.I., etc.)  This way, it could be anything from just like the original with 1 or two changes that people feel are out of balance in the original, to completely wacky and strange, but still basically the same game.

3. Enhanced mode with new features - new commodities, new events, longer games, more land - anything the developers dream up that makes the game fun.

I think there is plenty of room in one version of M.U.L.E. for all this (though the basics should be covered first), though I would certainly understand if with all this work, whoever developed this product wanted to charge for it.  Certainly, if one were to charge even $15-$20, there should be more "bang for the buck" than just the original game.

A great example of this approach is the remake of a game many here might be familiar with, and which I always thought of as the "sister" game to M.U.L.E. - Archon.  Over at ReactGames, they are doing all these things.  The graphics and music are enhanced, but they have been tweaking the gameplay to make it exactly like the original, with the same rules, the same board, and everything.  Then, there is an enhanced mode, with some new elements, then a crazy mode, with all kinds of additions, and finally, a Conquest game, which takes the engine and uses it in a completely different way.  In addition, there are tweaks that can be turned on or off in most of the modes.

M.U.L.E. could have all these things, but it would probably be more, because at the core, I think it's a deeper game, and there are so many parameters that could be played with.  I see it as a beginning of turn-based strategy games, and we see how complex they have gotten.  However, I do like the idea that a few people can sit down to a game of M.U.L.E. that is complete in an hour, and I hope that element is always available.

[Tei]

4. History mode.

The game can provide "Game Master" plots, so the 5th player play as "Game master" and spawn events as following a history.   It may make not much sense for most people, but there are some tabletop games that let you roleplay ... helll.. that how RPG was invented.   It may also give a framework for coop: this colony mission is to produce M units of food to save a starving home planet, but will be attacked by the klingon pirates to try to stop that..